Hellhammer
Apr 8, 09:01 AM
The trouble is .. I find the TDP numbers for Sandy Bridge very misleading. For example the previous i7 2.66Ghz dual core had a TDP of 35W and the current i7 2.2Ghz quad core has a TDP of 45W. Theoretically, it should only use 10W more when doing CPU intensive task, but according to anandtech who measured the task, the i7 Sandy Bridge Quad core was using almost 40W more when running cinebench.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4205/the-macbook-pro-review-13-and-15-inch-2011-brings-sandy-bridge/14
It just doesn't make any sense. Going by those figures, if the i7 dual core was 35W, the i7 Sandy Bridge quad core would be around 70W.
Not sure how this relates to potential MacBook Air Sandy Bridge processors, but keep in mind.. there must be a reason why Samsung went for the ULV processor in their 13" laptop instead of the LV one.
CPU isn't the only thing that changed. AMD 6750M (~30W) has higher TDP than NVidia GT 330M (~23W). I had to put ~ because their TDPs are not officially stated by AMD or NVidia so it's just based on previous GPUs and their TDPs. The point is that AMD 6750M has higher TDP.
There is also another thing. TDP is not the maximum power draw. Maximum power dissipation is usually 20-30% more than the actual TDP. While MPD is rarely achieved as it requires maximum voltage and temperature, it can (nearly) be achieved with heavy benchmarking applications.
For example, the combined TDP from quad core SB and AMD 6750M is 75W. If we use 20% extra as the MPD, that is 90W, just from the CPU and GPU! Of course those parts are not using 90W in that test because things like screen, HD, RAM etc need power too. As the MPD is usually in percents, it can explain why the difference is so big in watts.
40W sounds a bit too much to explain with MPD though. IIRC the GT 330M is underclocked but I'm not 100% sure. You have a valid point that the SBs may be using more power than their predecessors. To make this more accurate, we should compare them with C2Ds though ;)
I guess we will have to wait and see, but an ULV in 13" would be more than a disappointment.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4205/the-macbook-pro-review-13-and-15-inch-2011-brings-sandy-bridge/14
It just doesn't make any sense. Going by those figures, if the i7 dual core was 35W, the i7 Sandy Bridge quad core would be around 70W.
Not sure how this relates to potential MacBook Air Sandy Bridge processors, but keep in mind.. there must be a reason why Samsung went for the ULV processor in their 13" laptop instead of the LV one.
CPU isn't the only thing that changed. AMD 6750M (~30W) has higher TDP than NVidia GT 330M (~23W). I had to put ~ because their TDPs are not officially stated by AMD or NVidia so it's just based on previous GPUs and their TDPs. The point is that AMD 6750M has higher TDP.
There is also another thing. TDP is not the maximum power draw. Maximum power dissipation is usually 20-30% more than the actual TDP. While MPD is rarely achieved as it requires maximum voltage and temperature, it can (nearly) be achieved with heavy benchmarking applications.
For example, the combined TDP from quad core SB and AMD 6750M is 75W. If we use 20% extra as the MPD, that is 90W, just from the CPU and GPU! Of course those parts are not using 90W in that test because things like screen, HD, RAM etc need power too. As the MPD is usually in percents, it can explain why the difference is so big in watts.
40W sounds a bit too much to explain with MPD though. IIRC the GT 330M is underclocked but I'm not 100% sure. You have a valid point that the SBs may be using more power than their predecessors. To make this more accurate, we should compare them with C2Ds though ;)
I guess we will have to wait and see, but an ULV in 13" would be more than a disappointment.
Macinposh
Aug 17, 02:55 PM
I have a new 3.0 Intel- just letting you know they are not as close as Rob's test under real world performance. Adobe camera raw really screamed on my G5 and is noticibly slower and a bit buggy on my new Mac Pro. Start up is alot slower, etc, etc. He only tested MP aware processes which isn't the whole picture.
Have you used cs2s or canon�s raw converters? How do they work?
What is the general feeling of yours how the new machine works in photog business?
2 x 2 drive stripe raids.
So you have 4hdds in total,with 2 of each in raid 0 or what?
Do you have the os on one pair and scratch on the other pair?
Ordering the new rig in couple of weeks,so i am buggin you now.
Have you used cs2s or canon�s raw converters? How do they work?
What is the general feeling of yours how the new machine works in photog business?
2 x 2 drive stripe raids.
So you have 4hdds in total,with 2 of each in raid 0 or what?
Do you have the os on one pair and scratch on the other pair?
Ordering the new rig in couple of weeks,so i am buggin you now.
63dot
Aug 18, 09:21 AM
and if you guys have old powermac g5 dualcore sitting around because you got a new mac pro. i'll help you dispose of it no problem. i'll even do it for free. ;)
hey bokdol, you and i can start a business and help all the intel mac pro users dispose of their old G5 power macs
we can go into business :)
hey bokdol, you and i can start a business and help all the intel mac pro users dispose of their old G5 power macs
we can go into business :)
Tommy Wasabi
Apr 25, 04:36 PM
Block box in your car tracks not only where you are but the speed in which you are traveling. These black boxes are used by the insurance company if you get in an accident.
The phone company tracks where you are - and it is stored and can be requested by any law enforcement agency and have the data within 10 minutes of the submission.
I wonder if people are going to sue the auto industry, the insurance industry, and the phone companies.
Oh wait, this is American, land of lawyers - give them until Friday to write their brief and file in a some courthouse located in the Eastern District of Texas.
The phone company tracks where you are - and it is stored and can be requested by any law enforcement agency and have the data within 10 minutes of the submission.
I wonder if people are going to sue the auto industry, the insurance industry, and the phone companies.
Oh wait, this is American, land of lawyers - give them until Friday to write their brief and file in a some courthouse located in the Eastern District of Texas.
THX1139
Jul 23, 02:29 AM
For the laptop segment, by the Holiday's, the MacBooks should be equal to the QUAD G5 in power, with the MBP 8 cores (2x4), and desktops in all various ranges.....especially with UB programs, all the way up to 4x4.
You mean the Holiday season of 2007? You must believe in Santa Claus. You aren't going to be seeing Macbooks equaling the speed of the G5 Quad any time soon. Quad in a Macbook by December? No way. You won't see it in a MBP either...
You mean the Holiday season of 2007? You must believe in Santa Claus. You aren't going to be seeing Macbooks equaling the speed of the G5 Quad any time soon. Quad in a Macbook by December? No way. You won't see it in a MBP either...
Unspeaked
Nov 29, 11:12 AM
But I can definitely see why Apple wouldn't do that. Universal could threaten to yank all their content from iTunes if Apple refuses but at this point that might hurt Universal more than Apple.
I don't know, see the list up above and tell me that it wouldn't hurt Apple to not have those artists available on the iTunes store (um, U2, anyone?).
Plus, if Universal pulled out, it would probably open the floodgates for other labels to threaten the same thing...
We might hate to admit it as Apple fans, but Apple needs the labels for the iTunes store to work just as much as the label needs Apple.
I don't know, see the list up above and tell me that it wouldn't hurt Apple to not have those artists available on the iTunes store (um, U2, anyone?).
Plus, if Universal pulled out, it would probably open the floodgates for other labels to threaten the same thing...
We might hate to admit it as Apple fans, but Apple needs the labels for the iTunes store to work just as much as the label needs Apple.
zero2dash
Sep 18, 02:26 PM
The Thinkpad X40 I'm typing from Bluescreened on me no longer than three weeks ago. My crime? coming out of suspend mode.
Windows Crashes.
Believe it or not, Mac OS X can crash too. While it is prettier, it's still a crash.
Pretty funny reading the last few pages, thanks for the laughs.
I'll never forget at my old job (Kinkos) when our dual G4 running Panther had that system crash screen come up that is gray and basically says "your FUBAR'D" in like 8 languages...we were all stunned. :D Good times...never thought I'd see a bad crash like that in OSX. Or back in 2000 when our workstations were all running Windows 95b - I lost track of how many blue screens we'd get in a day. Man Win95 was garbage. :p Big for it's time - utter garbage now.
Windows Crashes.
Believe it or not, Mac OS X can crash too. While it is prettier, it's still a crash.
Pretty funny reading the last few pages, thanks for the laughs.
I'll never forget at my old job (Kinkos) when our dual G4 running Panther had that system crash screen come up that is gray and basically says "your FUBAR'D" in like 8 languages...we were all stunned. :D Good times...never thought I'd see a bad crash like that in OSX. Or back in 2000 when our workstations were all running Windows 95b - I lost track of how many blue screens we'd get in a day. Man Win95 was garbage. :p Big for it's time - utter garbage now.
starflyer
Nov 29, 11:03 AM
Oh yeah - for anyone who thinks most music these days sucks, you're just looking in the wrong place. Major labels ceased to produce anything of worth quite some time ago. Dig a little deeper and there's a wealth of wonderful music being made right now (and over the last 10 years specifically).
I'll help you dig...
www.sf59.com
www.toothandnailrecords.com
www.themilitiagroup.com
www.velvetbluemusic.com
www.jadetree.com
I'll help you dig...
www.sf59.com
www.toothandnailrecords.com
www.themilitiagroup.com
www.velvetbluemusic.com
www.jadetree.com
KnightWRX
Apr 7, 10:46 AM
but to say that intel forced apple to use the IGP is not correct imo.
No indeed, it's not. Intel forced the whole OEM industry to use their IGP, not just Apple. ;)
No matter how you slice it, for some applications, IGPs make sense. Intel cut out the competence from that market with their shenanigans. And now the consumers pays for it with sub-par graphics processors.
No indeed, it's not. Intel forced the whole OEM industry to use their IGP, not just Apple. ;)
No matter how you slice it, for some applications, IGPs make sense. Intel cut out the competence from that market with their shenanigans. And now the consumers pays for it with sub-par graphics processors.
iJawn108
Aug 7, 03:26 PM
Hey nice to see osx will have system restore =D
Lord Blackadder
Mar 24, 02:25 PM
I'm not the one leveling unfounded, sweeping, non-cited accusations of racism, but I guess that doesn't bother you. Color me surprised.
I'm not going to to hold up this discussion with it any further, and while I stand by my general assertion it was slightly rash for me to inject it here. Another day perhaps.
I'm not going to to hold up this discussion with it any further, and while I stand by my general assertion it was slightly rash for me to inject it here. Another day perhaps.
Chupa Chupa
Apr 11, 07:51 AM
I'm sure the idiot fanboys will buy it no matter what, but people like myself (who actually make a living and want reliable, efficient software) are ready to leave.
Then that just begs the question, "why haven't these people left already?" FCP has been fairly stagnant for years. There are plenty of other alternatives, so doesn't that kinda make them fanboyish too for sticking it out when up to this point Apple has given zero hints about when or how it will take FCP to the next level?
I'm not in the video editing biz, but if the pro s/w I use in my profession hobbled my efficiency and workflow the way you are carping about FCP, and there were viable alternatives, I would abandon it quicker than pigeon can snatch a bread crumb. Just sayin'.
Then that just begs the question, "why haven't these people left already?" FCP has been fairly stagnant for years. There are plenty of other alternatives, so doesn't that kinda make them fanboyish too for sticking it out when up to this point Apple has given zero hints about when or how it will take FCP to the next level?
I'm not in the video editing biz, but if the pro s/w I use in my profession hobbled my efficiency and workflow the way you are carping about FCP, and there were viable alternatives, I would abandon it quicker than pigeon can snatch a bread crumb. Just sayin'.
Hellhammer
Apr 6, 11:26 AM
Hellhammer, can I ask you something about this? There are SB LV and now SB ULV. Both are for laptops and the Macbook Pro 13 has SB LV, right? Or does the Pro has something else? What is the performance difference between an equally clocked ULV and LV?
Thanks!
13" MBP uses SV chips, i.e. standard voltage (35W). Before it used MV (medium voltage, 25W) chips but Sandy Bridge does not offer CPUs like that. LV (25W) and ULV (17W) chips have not been released yet but will be released shortly like the article says.
If the clock speed and other specs are the same, then the performance is the same. ULV and LV chips are only separated by the TDP which causes the ULV to have lower clock speed. Otherwise they are the same chips.
Thanks!
13" MBP uses SV chips, i.e. standard voltage (35W). Before it used MV (medium voltage, 25W) chips but Sandy Bridge does not offer CPUs like that. LV (25W) and ULV (17W) chips have not been released yet but will be released shortly like the article says.
If the clock speed and other specs are the same, then the performance is the same. ULV and LV chips are only separated by the TDP which causes the ULV to have lower clock speed. Otherwise they are the same chips.
HecubusPro
Sep 19, 12:54 PM
I'm kinda glad they didn't release the macbook pro's today. All that means, if they are released next week, it will be more than just a minor update :-D Here's to hoping!
I don't know if that's proof or a reason enough to think they'll have more than a chip drop-in, but I'm certainly hoping that it does get announced, and that you're right. :)
I don't know if that's proof or a reason enough to think they'll have more than a chip drop-in, but I'm certainly hoping that it does get announced, and that you're right. :)
baeder
Jul 15, 01:19 AM
Is it possible that the lower end models (rumored to be single processor) will be upgradeable by BTO or later on by the user by putting in another processor?
Scottsdale
Apr 6, 11:31 AM
I'm pretty sure you are aware that Apple would use LV CPU in 13", not ULV. That bumps us to 2.3GHz plus Turbo. You have said this yourself too and I already covered the reason in my other post.
This is just a MR article and surprisingly, they don't have much idea about the TDPs. Hopefully they will correct their article so people won't live in confusion.
That isn't what this story reads, and I don't think anyone but you and I have even read the actual facts supposed here.
I actually find this one of the least accurate stories ever posted on MacRumors.com for several reasons... the OP is assuming ULV in the 13" MBA. The OP is assuming that if SB IGP is good enough for MBP it's fine for MBA. There is no rumor or timeframe listing these chips especially not in the 13" MBA. It seems like it's a blatant attempt to stir up activity without any real facts, rumors, or even common knowledge about the chips used in the MBAs.
Certainly the people haven't read the story or they're somehow focusing on the 11" MBA. Sure, this would be fine for the 11" MBA in terms of CPU clock speed but even then it's a gigantic loss in the graphics capabilities. That leads to a problem with the author saying good enough for 13" MBP than good enough for MBA. However, the IGP clock speed used in this ULV chip will be nearly a 50% drop in graphics performance. That for me doesn't equate to if this then that...
I am disappointed with MR for even writing such a poor piece of garbage. Forget that I cannot stand the SB IGP... the assumptions made here are absurd! It
definitely doesn't warrant this sort of reply from the fans of the MBA. You and I
could assume things all day, but that isn't the story written.
This is just a MR article and surprisingly, they don't have much idea about the TDPs. Hopefully they will correct their article so people won't live in confusion.
That isn't what this story reads, and I don't think anyone but you and I have even read the actual facts supposed here.
I actually find this one of the least accurate stories ever posted on MacRumors.com for several reasons... the OP is assuming ULV in the 13" MBA. The OP is assuming that if SB IGP is good enough for MBP it's fine for MBA. There is no rumor or timeframe listing these chips especially not in the 13" MBA. It seems like it's a blatant attempt to stir up activity without any real facts, rumors, or even common knowledge about the chips used in the MBAs.
Certainly the people haven't read the story or they're somehow focusing on the 11" MBA. Sure, this would be fine for the 11" MBA in terms of CPU clock speed but even then it's a gigantic loss in the graphics capabilities. That leads to a problem with the author saying good enough for 13" MBP than good enough for MBA. However, the IGP clock speed used in this ULV chip will be nearly a 50% drop in graphics performance. That for me doesn't equate to if this then that...
I am disappointed with MR for even writing such a poor piece of garbage. Forget that I cannot stand the SB IGP... the assumptions made here are absurd! It
definitely doesn't warrant this sort of reply from the fans of the MBA. You and I
could assume things all day, but that isn't the story written.
NATO
Nov 28, 06:18 PM
I think they'll be a long way off getting money from every iPod sold. For a start its such an illogical thing to ask for (Did the music companies ask for money for every CD player or Tape Recorder sold? Nope), plus I suspect the main reason that Microsoft agreed to pay money in the first place is that they needed to get the music labels on board to boost the Zune Music Store, Microsoft was in the weaker position here and I believe the labels exploited that weakness.
If the labels were to go to Apple and demand a royalty on every iPod and threatening to pull their catalogue if they didn't get it, they would actually come off worse than Apple in terms of lost revenue and it's because of this I reckon they haven't a chance...
If the labels were to go to Apple and demand a royalty on every iPod and threatening to pull their catalogue if they didn't get it, they would actually come off worse than Apple in terms of lost revenue and it's because of this I reckon they haven't a chance...
QCassidy352
Jul 27, 10:50 AM
nice. :) I'm predicting no MBPs at WWDC, just mac pros, leopard preview, and maybe new displays. MBPs will be quietly updated with Merom a week or two later and start shipping soon after that.
unless there's a new case design (which I doubt) - if there is, Steve would have something impressive to show up on stage.
unless there's a new case design (which I doubt) - if there is, Steve would have something impressive to show up on stage.
mBox
Apr 6, 08:17 AM
Problem is, its still Final Cut and will still suck at managing media.I work in all three worlds with NLE (Avid, Apple & Adobe). If your know what your doing, then Media Management should be as easy as pie. Now do you have something specific that irks you about FCP? For starters I instruct at a local college in the evenings. I first burn it in my students heads that they need to use an separate drive for this app.
Im just throwing in the obvious of course ;)
Im just throwing in the obvious of course ;)
Jimmieboy
Sep 19, 04:07 AM
An update isn't going to make me go out and by a macbook or macbook pro. I'm waiting for leopard. Hopefully the updates (if any) will lower the price of the ibooks. I'm kinda interested in getting a new one for cheap. Anyway
samcraig
Apr 27, 10:05 AM
No they won't stand out in the data, because each cell tower or Wi-Fi hotspot is only included once in the database. And there is no information regarding how much time you spend in each location.
If locations are recorded AND time/date stamp - then how much time you spend in each location is tracked inherently. If you "log in" at one time here and then another 20 minutes later - there's a history of time spent. Maybe not foolproof... but to say that no information is there isn't accurate.
If locations are recorded AND time/date stamp - then how much time you spend in each location is tracked inherently. If you "log in" at one time here and then another 20 minutes later - there's a history of time spent. Maybe not foolproof... but to say that no information is there isn't accurate.
NoSmokingBandit
Dec 10, 07:07 PM
I finished the Sebastien Loeb Challenge. It was incredible.
I got a few decent shots along the way. I have more but i got tired of the copy/paste routine.
I think they turned out alright, its the first time i've actually played with all of the settings.
Clicky for 1920x1080
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/canada2113/gt5/EigerNordwandKTrail.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/canada2113/gt5/ChamonixMain.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/canada2113/gt5/Toscana.jpg
(it was in the middle of the day. filters are fun)
I got a few decent shots along the way. I have more but i got tired of the copy/paste routine.
I think they turned out alright, its the first time i've actually played with all of the settings.
Clicky for 1920x1080
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/canada2113/gt5/EigerNordwandKTrail.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/canada2113/gt5/ChamonixMain.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a93/canada2113/gt5/Toscana.jpg
(it was in the middle of the day. filters are fun)
Lord Blackadder
Mar 22, 12:48 PM
Though, for what it's worth, I'd much rather we returned to the constitutional practice of getting approval from congress before committing ourselves to military intervention.
I agree with the sentiment, though I wonder how much difference it would make - Bush managed to lie, cheat and steal a vote out of congress in favor of the Iraq invasion. Plenty of congress members were either duped or cowed into voting in favor. It wasn't a declared war, it was even better - he had congressional sanction without being restrained by a declared war.
I agree with the sentiment, though I wonder how much difference it would make - Bush managed to lie, cheat and steal a vote out of congress in favor of the Iraq invasion. Plenty of congress members were either duped or cowed into voting in favor. It wasn't a declared war, it was even better - he had congressional sanction without being restrained by a declared war.
edenwaith
Jul 14, 04:39 PM
2003: "In 12 months, we'll be at 3GHz".
Mid 2006: "I want to talk about 2.66GHz" although 4 cores running at 2.66GHz (Yum! :D ).
Kind of odd/funny how we seem to be going backwards in processor speeds. Instead of 3.6 GHz Pentiums, we are looking at 2.x GHz Intel Cores. It would be interesting to see how well a single Core processor matches up to PowerPC, or a Pentium, or AMD.
However, I am finding one of my predicitions finally happen...it appears that a ceiling has been currently met on how fast the current line of processors can go, and now we are relying on multiple cores/processors to distribute work, instead of relying on just one fast chip.
So when will we start seeing 8 chips in a computer? Perhaps this will become the new measurement...not processor speeds, but the number of processors (or cores).
Mid 2006: "I want to talk about 2.66GHz" although 4 cores running at 2.66GHz (Yum! :D ).
Kind of odd/funny how we seem to be going backwards in processor speeds. Instead of 3.6 GHz Pentiums, we are looking at 2.x GHz Intel Cores. It would be interesting to see how well a single Core processor matches up to PowerPC, or a Pentium, or AMD.
However, I am finding one of my predicitions finally happen...it appears that a ceiling has been currently met on how fast the current line of processors can go, and now we are relying on multiple cores/processors to distribute work, instead of relying on just one fast chip.
So when will we start seeing 8 chips in a computer? Perhaps this will become the new measurement...not processor speeds, but the number of processors (or cores).
